Hard to feel a few percent, Cam will be the test, Mapping is the Key
BS6/Euro5 477 now possible - Racedynamics released the new V.4 Powertronic for the Hima
- Thread starter sam2019
- Start date
Mapping is foundamental, but be aware that the map I provided "mimicks" the map of the PC elaborated by HMC for its 462.Hard to feel a few percent, Cam will be the test, Mapping is the Key
So it will still be far from optimal.
A good starting point though.
Unfortunately without at least one/two dyno runs there is nothing more I can do...
it seems important who does the dyno runs. I mean my own experience in Delhi a few years back was abysmal and now the mechanics at Racedynamics deliver a dynoed map for a 477 that leads to knocking while you can deduct from a different device's map what a better setting is.
Racedynamics is a shitshow. Calling their helpline is close to useless and the answers one gets are mostly guesses and probably also mostly wrong.
If I had listened to them I would have installed the fuelx on top of the PT in hopes that this solves the knocking - which it might have but I would have missed the chance to fix it by the PT alone as Sasa did. What a bunch of clowns!
The cam was put in, while at it I also cut the air filter cover for more flow enhancement.
The good news is: after the HT-b cam was in together with the 477 the engine started nicely, idled well and ran - OK-ish.
I mean I could NOT get it to knock, no matter how hard I accelerated.
The not-so-good news is: power (or torque) in the low RPMs is now LESS than before (I know I know, how is that even possible ..) and real jumpy it gets only above 3500/4000 RPM - a range I rarely visit.
The bike also did not ride as smooth as it was with only the 477, kinda a little bit irregular - not too much and an unsuspecting rider may take it for normal - but of course I know the bike and it did run smoother before.
The news about no knocking and good startup and idle is good - very good in fact because it means the 477 plus cam can be run with only a PTV4. However - there will be updates of that map needed to make it a worthwhile experience.
I would ask ONX to run a dyno shift with a fully monthied bike but given these morons weren't able to even make a useful map with only a 477 that seems a less than hopeful route. Anyone having any other ideas?
cut air filter cover:
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Not enough Fuel to take advantage of the breathing runs lean feels crappy.
Other people would complain about the the Cam. it is no good see it runs worse with a performance cam, how can that be possible? isn't it called a Performance Cam!
We will not be fooled so easily
Other people would complain about the the Cam. it is no good see it runs worse with a performance cam, how can that be possible? isn't it called a Performance Cam!
We will not be fooled so easily
So - what to do? just add fuel? I mean I can certainly add lets say 20% to what the map shows now across the board. That is not very scientific but thats all I can do by myself. If someone knows a little more sophisticated attempt I am listening
with wire make a Pointer that is moved by the Throttle
Now you have the Map the Compass and you are in it, this is no different to being lost in the Jungle
Now you have the Map the Compass and you are in it, this is no different to being lost in the Jungle
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Then using the Laptop and Software mark out some Percentage points in some white tape or a cut up label like that, using the Rev Gauge you now have 2 way triangulation or something and you can find where you are on the Map, reading maps aint rocket science
Sam, unfortunately a dyno session without the proper live tuning won't provide (to me) useful data to correct the map, because I don't know what the base map is.So - what to do? just add fuel? I mean I can certainly add lets say 20% to what the map shows now across the board. That is not very scientific but thats all I can do by myself. If someone knows a little more sophisticated attempt I am listening
What I could say is that you could try adding +7% to all cells in the row from 0 to 100%TPS and column between 500RPM and 5000RPM.
Add +4% on all the other cells in the map (so 0 to 100%TPS on column above 5000RPM).
This addition has to be made on top of the existing number so if the number in the cell is, say 17, add 7 (24 final value) or add 4 (21 final value) depending on where is the cell in the range (see above).
Also, for good measure, add +1 on the ignition to all cells in the row up to 25%TPS.
What I would do is first to copy all values from the map you're using to the other map (so the base map stays untouched) for both fuel and ignition and then apply the changes suggested above.
I'll do that today and check ride - if it does not solve the problem I re-install fuelx pro and see how that works.
I was going to implement Sasa's changes when I realized that the ignition data had been preserved but not the fuel data. which means yesterdays ride was done with the map done by RD PLUS Sasa's ignition data - and not the fuel data as well.
Reason was that I had no (and still have no) manual for the software and can hardly read the 10' screen in broad daylight - the software said "writing data to device" - which meant temporarily - there is a tiny button in the lower right corner saying "burn" which I overlooked.
I was able to retrieve the fuel data from a map I had saved but lo and behold, no way to copy that stuff to the ignition data map. I had to do the entire shebang again, one field at a time.
A subsequent test ride showed more torque - not as much as the carby but clearly more than before. starting was easy and cold run was OK - after about 1 minute (before that I could kill the engine with a sudden turn of the accelerator). Overall performance was similar to the BS4 with the latest map (as much as my butt is good enough to determine that).
I have taken the PT out of the bike which is problematic because there is one small connector that is very low quality and will not sustain repeated uses - although the main connector is easy to use and very solid. However if done only on occasion this procedure will work and allow you to modify the map in the comfort of your office on a big screen.
This is the connector that will eventually break - and a view of the 10' screen in daylight
Reason was that I had no (and still have no) manual for the software and can hardly read the 10' screen in broad daylight - the software said "writing data to device" - which meant temporarily - there is a tiny button in the lower right corner saying "burn" which I overlooked.
I was able to retrieve the fuel data from a map I had saved but lo and behold, no way to copy that stuff to the ignition data map. I had to do the entire shebang again, one field at a time.
A subsequent test ride showed more torque - not as much as the carby but clearly more than before. starting was easy and cold run was OK - after about 1 minute (before that I could kill the engine with a sudden turn of the accelerator). Overall performance was similar to the BS4 with the latest map (as much as my butt is good enough to determine that).
I have taken the PT out of the bike which is problematic because there is one small connector that is very low quality and will not sustain repeated uses - although the main connector is easy to use and very solid. However if done only on occasion this procedure will work and allow you to modify the map in the comfort of your office on a big screen.
This is the connector that will eventually break - and a view of the 10' screen in daylight
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Just for fun I am preparing a map with Sasa's further enhancements, fuel and ignition, just to see if it make the bike run even better.
There seems to be no need to put the FuelX back - which is a big relief because of cramped space under the seat.
There seems to be no need to put the FuelX back - which is a big relief because of cramped space under the seat.
Keep us posted.
Did a short around-the-block test run and YES !!! now the bike feels close if not identical to the carby.
So this map with added 7 or 4 will be the one I suggest for ppl with 477 and cam and available from the download page.
That map is 90/95% tuned.
Imagine what I could do in a proper live tuning session!
But you have to pay my ticket back and forth to India!
Try to do like this: make a file in which you insert the map you had yesterday on one slot and the one of today on the other, this way you'll have a "performance" map and a milder one for everyday use.
I did exactly that - the map to download has map1 as the "milder" map and map2 as the one with 7+4 plus enhanced timing
